Most know at least who the artist is and that takes literally just a couple of touches to get there and they are done pretty fast. Some only have a repertoire of about 10 songs anyway so finding them is also just a couple of touches too. You can browse and you'll find that there are better times to browse than others... for example, I get a whole slew of singers at the start of a show and after about 10 minutes, the kiosk is empty because the singers are waiting to be called up.... perfect time to browse because from that point on, there is no more "rush period" and it's fairly steady all night. You'd also be surprised how many strangers strike up a conversation at the kiosk... kind of like the office water cooler ... they help each other and make suggestions for each other etc.... it's turned out to be a meeting spot of sorts too....
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how many here are thinking of going to kiosks
- Thread starter KjAthena
- Start date
Most know at least who the artist is and that takes literally just a couple of touches to get there and they are done pretty fast. Some only have a repertoire of about 10 songs anyway so finding them is also just a couple of touches too. You can browse and you'll find that there are better times to browse than others... for example, I get a whole slew of singers at the start of a show and after about 10 minutes, the kiosk is empty because the singers are waiting to be called up.... perfect time to browse because from that point on, there is no more "rush period" and it's fairly steady all night. You'd also be surprised how many strangers strike up a conversation at the kiosk... kind of like the office water cooler ... they help each other and make suggestions for each other etc.... it's turned out to be a meeting spot of sorts too....
Does your kiosk work on Vista or WIN7? I'm already running these and it wouldn't cost me anything extra to put one of my laptops to work as a kiosk other than the cost of the software.
Do you have a multi-use license so that attendees with their own laptops can operate a kiosk at my shows?
You see, making a pdf doesn't seem all that complicated to me. For your kiosk to work, you have to start with the same list of files. After that, it's just updating the pdf and redistributing. The pdf format is native to each up-to-date operating system that I've looked at. I've been waiting for the prices on the Ipad to drop because when I held it in my hand and flipped through the pages of my song-book just like I would browse my paper books, I thought "how easy is this?". Nothing to teach. Works just like a book, it can be instantly updated and it has search/sort built right in. It also has the advantage of being multi-media so I can include things like last week's photos for viewing during the show. I've even looked at the large format Kindle and the last generation's price is already falling. Kindle also reads pdf files as a native format.
I've used a laptop for a songbook for over a year and the history file actually has the reverse effect for my singers than what you suggested. My singers look at the history file and choose songs they haven't sung yet. The people who want to sing the same songs over and over are going to do that regardless of their history file.
I've never had issues with people using that laptop. It doesn't create a line. I still think the tablet format for digital song-books is perfect. They all have wi-fi available now so you can use the network function and a chat client to send/receive song requests at little or no additional cost. Tracking software is only there as a safeguard and it is inexpensive and we all know how easy it is to install software. We'd have to be capable of installing the kiosk wouldn't we?
Back off on the hard-sell just a little. Think about how you'd want to learn about your product if you were the customer. By all means advocate your product and extol the benefits, but you might want to refrain from debating your potential customers' concerns. I'm not saying this to be critical, I'm saying this to be constructive, with respect.
Do you have a multi-use license so that attendees with their own laptops can operate a kiosk at my shows?
You see, making a pdf doesn't seem all that complicated to me. For your kiosk to work, you have to start with the same list of files. After that, it's just updating the pdf and redistributing. The pdf format is native to each up-to-date operating system that I've looked at. I've been waiting for the prices on the Ipad to drop because when I held it in my hand and flipped through the pages of my song-book just like I would browse my paper books, I thought "how easy is this?". Nothing to teach. Works just like a book, it can be instantly updated and it has search/sort built right in. It also has the advantage of being multi-media so I can include things like last week's photos for viewing during the show. I've even looked at the large format Kindle and the last generation's price is already falling. Kindle also reads pdf files as a native format.
I've used a laptop for a songbook for over a year and the history file actually has the reverse effect for my singers than what you suggested. My singers look at the history file and choose songs they haven't sung yet. The people who want to sing the same songs over and over are going to do that regardless of their history file.
I've never had issues with people using that laptop. It doesn't create a line. I still think the tablet format for digital song-books is perfect. They all have wi-fi available now so you can use the network function and a chat client to send/receive song requests at little or no additional cost. Tracking software is only there as a safeguard and it is inexpensive and we all know how easy it is to install software. We'd have to be capable of installing the kiosk wouldn't we?
Back off on the hard-sell just a little. Think about how you'd want to learn about your product if you were the customer. By all means advocate your product and extol the benefits, but you might want to refrain from debating your potential customers' concerns. I'm not saying this to be critical, I'm saying this to be constructive, with respect.
Sorry, doesn't happen....
Here we go with the "wait in line" thing...
For some reason -- and even I was guilty of this in the beginning -- there's this huge fear that there will be some long line of dedicated singers all itching to put in a song, and some dumb oaf standing at the kiosk browsing and he's only at the "C's" and can't read or spell very well....
I gotta tell you, after using a kiosk for 6 years, it just doesn't happen that way in real life. Maybe it's just that after so many years of working so hard on printed books, selecting typefaces, deciding on binding, number of columns, plastic sleeves, working on request slips, etc. it's just hard to think of karaoke without using them. Consequently, there's a myriad of pitfalls that are easy to invent as a natural progression if you were stop using them.
If you want to make it easier on yourself (and your singers if you think they will croak) then by all means, don't switch to a kisok, but supplement your books with a kiosk instead. At least to start with, because you will see that the books will be used less and less.
That's exactly what I did. I placed a kiosk in the club and next to it a stack of just 5 books - not on the tables, but next to the kiosk. They were welcome to take them to their table if they liked, and most would pick out their song and return the book to the stack - I never made that a requirement and frankly it surprised me too.
Since the kiosk was new, of course the first few nights I had to "educate" the singers on how to use it... surprisingly, it wasn't for more than a handful of singers before they began to help each other with an informal "tech support" if you want to call it that. It seems that people like showing other people what they know and how to use this new method of selecting songs. They all loved it and I loved not having to babysit them.
It's all good.... They still love it and help the new patrons that come in and all act very respectful around it.
Well Chip I guess your singers are perfect. Mine are not. And I've been to shows with a kiost and I've seen people waiting for several minutes to put in their request, then they end up just telling the KJ what they want because they can't(or don't want)to deal with the kiost.
Not trying to cut down the kiost idea, but using nothing the kiost all night for sign ups isolates you from your crowd. Not my style.
Does your kiosk work on Vista or WIN7? I'm already running these and it wouldn't cost me anything extra to put one of my laptops to work as a kiosk other than the cost of the software.
Sure. All you have to do is run virtual PC under XP mode and you're all set.
Do you have a multi-use license so that attendees with their own laptops can operate a kiosk at my shows?
You are welcome to purchase as many as you like to give to your attendees. Makes a wonderful holiday gift.
You see, making a pdf doesn't seem all that complicated to me. For your kiosk to work, you have to start with the same list of files. After that, it's just updating the pdf and redistributing. The pdf format is native to each up-to-date operating system that I've looked at. I've been waiting for the prices on the Ipad to drop because when I held it in my hand and flipped through the pages of my song-book just like I would browse my paper books, I thought "how easy is this?". Nothing to teach. Works just like a book, it can be instantly updated and it has search/sort built right in. It also has the advantage of being multi-media so I can include things like last week's photos for viewing during the show. I've even looked at the large format Kindle and the last generation's price is already falling. Kindle also reads pdf files as a native format.
Exactly. And in this case, you don't even have to do that, just copy a single file to it and a couple clicks and it does the rest. Same thing to update it.... copy a file and a couple clicks....
I've used a laptop for a songbook for over a year and the history file actually has the reverse effect for my singers than what you suggested. My singers look at the history file and choose songs they haven't sung yet. The people who want to sing the same songs over and over are going to do that regardless of their history file.
I've never had issues with people using that laptop. It doesn't create a line.
Then you tell that to Thunder who as always held that there is no way he could run a kiosk because his shows are far too busy for that and the ensuing line of singers would simply be out of the question.
I still think the tablet format for digital song-books is perfect. They all have wi-fi available now so you can use the network function and a chat client to send/receive song requests at little or no additional cost. Tracking software is only there as a safeguard and it is inexpensive and we all know how easy it is to install software. We'd have to be capable of installing the kiosk wouldn't we?
Uh oh..... Keep in mind that "Wi-Fi" is a LOT different than a "Wireless Network" setup. Good luck with that. And exactly how many of these $180.00 WiFi-enabled, GPS-tracked tablet computers are you going to hand out to your attendees? Two? Three? Five? And you're not only going to copy pictures of last week's show on each one, but have to put each on on a battery charger every night? You're making this way too complicated for yourself but who am I to tell you that you are reinventing the wheel when there are several models already available on the shelf.
Back off on the hard-sell just a little. Think about how you'd want to learn about your product if you were the customer. By all means advocate your product and extol the benefits, but you might want to refrain from debating your potential customers' concerns. I'm not saying this to be critical, I'm saying this to be constructive, with respect.
First of all, I'm not "hard selling" anything. It's up to you to use books, not use books, use a kiosk, make your own or anything else. No one is forcing you. This thread is about using "A Kiosk", not "using Chip's Kisok." So I'm not selling anything here. There are other kiosk programs - just ask DannyG.
And I'm not "debating" anyone here however, I will most certainly challenge the standard and unfounded fear(s) that many hosts have that there will be "no human interaction" (Audio One) or that there will be "a line of singers" (Thunder) -- A fear that even you admit (above) is unfounded and does NOT happen, and I thank you for that because I understand how easy it is for someone to think that I'd say only what they "want to hear" to make a sale. This isn't about "sales."
Like it or not, currently in this thread, I have the most "practical experience" with using a touchscreen kiosk in a karaoke environment. Years of experience with young crowds, older crowds, super-busy nights and slow nights. I know what the advantages are and what really happens when patrons are introduced to a kiosk. I'm not bragging by any means, but having a kiosk has given me an advantage over other shows that have far outweighed the fears that other KJ's have about using them.
As the developer, I have an additional insight into what functions most patrons will really use, not just a collection of functions that never get used. And because of this, I've been able to develop this "up close" to the end users by actually asking them -while they're using it- what they like, don't like, would like to see, need to get rid of, etc. It's not a "theoretical guess" at what I think they would like or not. Contrary to popular belief, this is not just a re-write of internet jukebox software.
So, and with all due respect as well, use a kiosk if you like, or don't. Buy one off the shelf or make your own if you like - whether it's simple or complicated, it doesn't matter to me. But I can tell you that you won't lose any "human interaction" or have any problems with lines based on my experience.
Tried it on XP in virtual pc on my Vista system. Mapped the drive with the tracks as a network drive... First 3:39 to search and just 8 total minutes to process 54,556 files and then when I click to print the books = "Kiosk Printer Error"
It appears as though your computer (in XP mode) does not have a printer driver installed. It doesn't have to have a printer attached, but it does need a driver and Visa doesn't make your current printer information available to XP mode . Add a printer driver by going to the control panel (in XP mode) and simply add a generic laserwriter. It needs a printer driver to calculate the column widths of the data it's writing so it knows where to break a line if the artist name + song title + disc id are too long for the line.
In XP Mode, Vista (or Win '7) doesn't share the printer driver (or really much else) to the "XP mode computer" so you were very smart to make your drive a network drive... Kudos to you Sandman!
And thanks for the screen shot of the error - as soon as I saw it I knew what was going on.
The timer clock you have on the screen is interesting for measuring the timing... that's cool. So if it took roughly eight minutes to get everything ready, I'll bet it won't take more than about an additional minute to fully complete the files. Searching the drive to find the files is usually the longest process. Let me know what the final number is...it's interesting to know..
In XP Mode, Vista (or Win '7) doesn't share the printer driver (or really much else) to the "XP mode computer" so you were very smart to make your drive a network drive... Kudos to you Sandman!
And thanks for the screen shot of the error - as soon as I saw it I knew what was going on.
The timer clock you have on the screen is interesting for measuring the timing... that's cool. So if it took roughly eight minutes to get everything ready, I'll bet it won't take more than about an additional minute to fully complete the files. Searching the drive to find the files is usually the longest process. Let me know what the final number is...it's interesting to know..
it appears as though your computer does not have a printer driver installed. It doesn't have to have a printer attached, but it does need a driver. Add a printer driver by going to the control panel and add a generic laserwriter. It needs a driver to calculate the column widths.
Installed an HP printer driver. Program works fine. This time it only took 6:17 start to finish. Impressive.
Now how do I remove duplicates and DiscId-Track#'s?
This book Artist listing is 510 pages! The Title listing is 611 pages!
Installed an HP printer driver. Program works fine. This time it only took 6:17 start to finish. Impressive.
Now how do I remove duplicates and DiscId-Track#'s?
There's a couple of ways for duplicates:
#1: The hard way:
Open the files in MS word and trash the duplicates line by line....
#2: The easier way:
First: Rename the file Hoster.dat to Hoster.csv and open it with Excel. Sort the columns under 2 conditions: first by Artist name (column "c") and then by Title (column "b") this will group all the duplicates together for you. You can then trash the dupes easier because they're grouped together. If you want you can now clear the contents of the discID column and simply place a period in each cell (fill down) Save the file.
Second: rename the file back to "hoster.dat" and go into your "book" folder and you'll find 2 program files there. Double click on "MP3GBOOK.EXE" and it will skip the disk scan and go to right to making the database and files.
This book Artist listing is 510 pages! The Title listing is 611 pages!
Interesting.... That's 205 and 306 sheets of paper respectively. If you combine them into one handy-dandy printed book then that's just over a REAM of paper (500 sheets) and using 20 lb bond paper, that a FIVE POUND book not including, plastic sleeves or the binder to hold it all together. Conservatively, figure an additional pound for those materials and 10 books will weigh in at a hefty sixty pounds! I can see why you'd want to eliminate duplicates.
I found a free csv editor that removed all the duplicate rows.
Now I get a strange error when trying to remake the books from the modified csv/dat file... see attached.
I checked the data within the csv file and the only way I found anything strange was when I copied and pasted the text columns from the spreadsheet to notepade.exe. There were several blank returns, empty lines at the end of the text file.
Now I get a strange error when trying to remake the books from the modified csv/dat file... see attached.
I checked the data within the csv file and the only way I found anything strange was when I copied and pasted the text columns from the spreadsheet to notepade.exe. There were several blank returns, empty lines at the end of the text file.
I found a free csv editor that removed all the duplicate rows.
Now I get a strange error when trying to remake the books from the modified csv/dat file... see attached.
There is no attached file BTW.
And, rather than Hijack this thread, I have a nice little surprise (an improvement) for you in the "48 hours and counting thread"..... go there now.
you can stop beating your head against the wall....
