darkpowrjd said:
Hmm, you mention that I missed things that were posted publicly, but when you went into detail, you instead tell me that you got links and PMs and whatever that I have to ask you for.
So Karaoke is not a form of musical entertainment? And is my point that Zoom's Karaoke products are available through iTunes is completely missed.
By the way, the PHM site never brings this up, but on the CB site (which I would assume that, if someone would have a question about this that the sites would be readily available and easily accessible), it says: "Karaoke shows that use tracks stored to a hard disk drive are doing so in violation of the Chartbuster Karaoke license printed on the original disc. Unless the tracks were purchased as digital downloads and are being played from the original disk onto which they were downloaded, the operator is in violation of the license. "
Though the context does make it into another case of a thing that the laws doesn't permit them to actually do, note the bold text. This implies that they DO allow DD tracks to be used, which is the entire argument here. In fact, all of their legal questions that deal with such a thing on their site brings their DD stuff up as the exception. Though I think they should make a program to allow you to authorize other systems to use the DD tracks (there is still a LOT of progress to be done with this issue), this shows that you are dead wrong about CB.
You underestimate me.:sqbiggrin:
darkpowrjd said:
Hmm, you mention that I missed things that were posted publicly, but when you went into detail, you instead tell me that you got links and PMs and whatever that I have to ask you for.
So Karaoke is not a form of musical entertainment? And is my point that Zoom's Karaoke products are available through iTunes is completely missed.
By the way, the PHM site never brings this up, but on the CB site (which I would assume that, if someone would have a question about this that the sites would be readily available and easily accessible), it says: "Karaoke shows that use tracks stored to a hard disk drive are doing so in violation of the Chartbuster Karaoke license printed on the original disc. Unless the tracks were purchased as digital downloads and are being played from the original disk onto which they were downloaded, the operator is in violation of the license. "
Though the context does make it into another case of a thing that the laws doesn't permit them to actually do, note the bold text. This implies that they DO allow DD tracks to be used, which is the entire argument here. In fact, all of their legal questions that deal with such a thing on their site brings their DD stuff up as the exception. Though I think they should make a program to allow you to authorize other systems to use the DD tracks (there is still a LOT of progress to be done with this issue), this shows that you are dead wrong about CB.
You underestimate me.:sqbiggrin:
To the best of my knowledge we aren't supposed to post links to other boards, since It could be considered advertising. However I have just re-read the post I was referring to, and you are correct they do authorize use in a show, but they still can't gauruntee that the rights holder won't come after you. I will bold the relevant sections
"Chartbuster Karaoke @ Wed Jun 02, 2010 3:03 pm wrote:
Apologies for taking so long to reply - and thanks to leopard lizard for starting the thread as requested.
From our website: "You are allowed to make a single copy of your Chartbuster Karaoke discs for archive purposes only. Please note that this does not entitle you to use those backed-up tracks for any other purpose than as a back-up, including playing, sharing, distribution or performance.
"Karaoke shows that use tracks stored to a hard disk drive are doing so in violation of the Chartbuster Karaoke license printed on the original disc. Unless the tracks were purchased as digital downloads and are being played from the original disk onto which they were downloaded, the operator is in violation of the license."
You will note that for the purposes of a track that is ripped from a disc, only the disc is authorized for use in a Karaoke Show setting, and not the ripped track.
When you purchase a digital download from our online store, you are given a receipt from that transaction. It is the only record you will have that you legally obtained the track, since no physical disc accompanies the purchase.
If you have a digital download, have your receipts, and are performing a karaoke show, as long as your other licenses are in order, you are authorized to use a Chartbuster Karaoke track purchased in this fashion in your show. This does not confer any other license to you - you must still conform to applicable copyright and performance rights laws, along with any other restriction(s) that may apply. It only expressly means that the use of the Chartbuster Karaoke rendition is authorized by Chartbuster Karaoke, and no other licenses, explicit or implicit, are conferred.
In addition, you should note that in cases of this nature, the courts have yet to determine what distinguishes a back-up copy from an original. Bear in mind that there is no distinguishing feature that can tell any two digital copies apart, other than the media on which they reside. In order to hew as closely as possible to what we believe to be the letter and the spirit of the law, we believe that it is important that the purchaser only download tracks directly to the hard disk drive from which it will be drawn during performance. We don't know how this will eventually shake out in the courts, but until a precedent has been set, this is what we recommend. It may or may not save your entrepreneurial backside later down the road, but it might provide some protection.
Does this mean that the publishers won't come after you for using a digital download in a show? Well, we don't know, and I don't think anyone else does at this point either. They might decide they have bigger fish to fry, even if they think you are infringing. Or they might smell money and land on you with both feet. It's anybody's guess.
Please also note that we make karaoke, not law. We do our best to give you the viewpoint and perspective from where we are sitting. Do not construe any of this to be legal advice - when in doubt, ask your lawyer.
Is this unambiguous enough for the forum?"
Also I have two problems with their downloads.
1. 80-90% of their catalog is currently unavailable as downloads inlcuding ALL of their monthly releases, which in my opinion would be the main point in wanting digital downloads.
2. Their downloads are only available at 128Kbps and sound like CRAP, in my opinion.
Still I was wrong about chartbuster, so I apologize in that regard.
Also you are correct that I forgot to address your comment on Zoom for which I also apologize. If Itunes is selling ZOOM tracks, my next question would be, have you bought any? If I were a betting person, I would bet that none of them contain the GRAPHIC portion and are music only.
To answer your question directly NO in the eyes of the law, karaoke is NOT a form of musical entertainment. It is viewed the exact same as any TV show or Movie. And no matter how much you ignore or gloss over the fact the LAWS for Audio Visual Works and Musical works are different in North America.
-James
P.S. I have just read over your post about the Pop Hits monthly site and I finally understand your confusion. Yes, they are selling their music in the mp3+g format but ONLY on CD ROM
discs. Stellar does NOT offer their mp3+G tracks as DOWNLOADS.
The only difference between what Soundchoice will be doing and Stellar is that Stellar's tracks are sold as 192Kbits and Soundchoice's tracks will be 320
