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LMAO
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Why Paris Is Burning
- Thread starter Sailor Kenshin
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Now you're making broad assumptions based on little evidence. I'm not saying any gifts given/recieved are null or void or whatever, but the fact is, it goes back and forth, it's a two-way process. I don't count what my friends owe me, but I try to repay their kindnesses with whatever I can. It's the way friendship works, and both sides need to realise that.Chrisl0 said:So you are trying to say them the gifts we gave the French are null/void also? But it's funny though you and countries like you complained in the old days that we didn't help enough but now we are doing too much. They and you always find a problem with us. Also we were one of more than one nation's that helped France but we helped them far more than the other's. Just like in Iraq, we are putting more money and manpower in their than any other country. If your precious Europe didn't screw up so many times we wouldn't have to take control the way we have. Also don't reply on how many things they did right because I can find thousands of years of screw ups that the countries in Europe have committed. Even a few that your precious France have committed. Also why don't you and people like you criticize your country for once. Last time I checked every country has problems and have committed wrongful acts in the past and present. Also when the day comes where China becomes power hungry I bet you and the other countries well come on their hands and knee's begging us to defend themselves. By the way which country are you from since you don't post it?
Which country are you assuming I'm from? You make a broad statement there that I'm from some country that demands more of the U.S., which may well be true, but still takes a random shot in the dark. But of course you guys are putting more money and manpower in Iraq. You invaded it. Your government invaded that country, now it has to clean up the mess.
Now you're also associating France with Europe. How does that come about? And why would Europe be precious to me? I don't live there. France isn't precious to me either. I'm not saying they are in any way special or deserving. I was merely responding to the idea that the U.S. gov't offer aid to insult France. As for a long history of things not done right,
You want problems with my country? O.k. The Aparthied system in South Africa was based in part on the way we treated our Aboriginals. Our contributions to charitable orginizations of late have been untimely at best. Our military is in dire need of an overhaul (but still is considered one of the most professional in the world) Our politics of late have been marred with scandal after scandal, which like Bush, nothing seems to stick. Hopefully this Gomery stuff will change that. We are one of the biggest polluters on the planet, we use more water per capita than the U.S. That's but a few things. It's enough info for you to go on to figure it out. But in the future, please refrain from making wild accusations.
I know! And for the love of God it has to stop! Why cant we just end relations with France? Why cant we just say, too hell with them, we wont ask for anything from them, they wont ask for anything from us. We need to become self sufficient and neutral like the founders wanted. We need to separate ourselves from the "Global Community" (Kudos to anyone who knows where I got that term, especially because you know why its so relevent) America needs to worry about America. We have enough of our own problems to deal with. We need to fix them first then we can start helping out the other people. France dug this hole let them dig out. We dug our selves into a pretty deep hole too. And if we start shoveling dirt into France's hole, its only going to make our hole deeper!Black Mage said:but the fact is, it goes back and forth, it's a two-way process.
Chrisl0 said:Cool I wish I had her in my room during the summer.
You would have to deal with the incessent ****ing. May I suggest a ball gag?
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So why don't we all become Canadian eh and forget the rest of the world. We'll just become one big happy family caring for each other and the mid-finger to all the rest of ya'- Except for England and Ireland of course.
Now that I have your attention with that off the wall comment, why should the United States be expected to jump in and save the world? It is the only country on this planet that is more than willing to lead in aid to all of the other countries yet everywhere you turn people are bashing the Americans. If they all think that we are so so bad then let's pull up stakes and high tail her out of the other countries and then sit back and observe just how well they do on their own. It might be just the hard lesson that most countries who depend on us need to wisen them up.
Now that I have your attention with that off the wall comment, why should the United States be expected to jump in and save the world? It is the only country on this planet that is more than willing to lead in aid to all of the other countries yet everywhere you turn people are bashing the Americans. If they all think that we are so so bad then let's pull up stakes and high tail her out of the other countries and then sit back and observe just how well they do on their own. It might be just the hard lesson that most countries who depend on us need to wisen them up.
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This thread has gone off the deep end it seems.
Admittedly to my perception, France does give off a perception of being anti-America or annoyance to Americans for 20 some odd years that I recall. Did bother me when we couldn't fly our military crafts over France to bomb Libya about 20 years ago. Haven't recalled they being very supportive since then but they are still an ally and are entitled to their opinion.
Each country has its faults and flaws. Americans knows their own flaws intimately, even if one denies it.
The Statue of Liberty was one of the great gifts they gave America. Along with the support of colonies against the British. True, it was politically motivated but what war doesn't have political motivations. Would any country would get involved in someone else war if they didn't have something to gain later? Some what cynical there but its true to a point.
In the last 30 years, there are probably many cases of countries slaughtering their own or other nations, in which no one does a thing about it.
I acknowledge France's contributions to America and Europe. But I have to say, they have a very mudded history as well. I think there is some resentment from the states mainly because they always appear to look down on America so there is an adverse pleasure by some to see that France has similiar if not worse problems then Americans.
Americans or other nations are take some perversed pleasure in the riots since only one death and very few injuries taken place even with all its destruction. If it was more disasterous such as many deadly clashes, think that perspective would have changed. Cars burned and such overall only effects the economy, not people lives.
France is receiving somewhat humbling experience for their nation. It could be benefitial or could turn the country for the worse. We won't know until years down the road. Things like these riots will have a long term effect since it was just one or two days. These have lasted 2 weeks already, if they still continue to go on.
Every big country has some event that embarrasses the country. Some wouldn't have been brought to light if it wasn't for interest groups/media like the incident in Pakistan.
If France would ask for support, I would support the cause. Not that they would. They would keep this an internal matter. No nation, unless they were falling apart would ask for outside help for incidents like this. The riots in LA for example. ALthough much shorter in time frame and smaller area of effect, we didn't call out NATO asking for help. It would embarrass us, so no politician in his right mind would call out for help. So they wouldn't ask other nations to assist mainly because it will look they can't maintain order on their own. This isn't like a disaster - London Bombings, World Trade Center terrorist attack, where investigative assistance into the matter would be helpful.
Admittedly to my perception, France does give off a perception of being anti-America or annoyance to Americans for 20 some odd years that I recall. Did bother me when we couldn't fly our military crafts over France to bomb Libya about 20 years ago. Haven't recalled they being very supportive since then but they are still an ally and are entitled to their opinion.
Each country has its faults and flaws. Americans knows their own flaws intimately, even if one denies it.
The Statue of Liberty was one of the great gifts they gave America. Along with the support of colonies against the British. True, it was politically motivated but what war doesn't have political motivations. Would any country would get involved in someone else war if they didn't have something to gain later? Some what cynical there but its true to a point.
In the last 30 years, there are probably many cases of countries slaughtering their own or other nations, in which no one does a thing about it.
I acknowledge France's contributions to America and Europe. But I have to say, they have a very mudded history as well. I think there is some resentment from the states mainly because they always appear to look down on America so there is an adverse pleasure by some to see that France has similiar if not worse problems then Americans.
Americans or other nations are take some perversed pleasure in the riots since only one death and very few injuries taken place even with all its destruction. If it was more disasterous such as many deadly clashes, think that perspective would have changed. Cars burned and such overall only effects the economy, not people lives.
France is receiving somewhat humbling experience for their nation. It could be benefitial or could turn the country for the worse. We won't know until years down the road. Things like these riots will have a long term effect since it was just one or two days. These have lasted 2 weeks already, if they still continue to go on.
Every big country has some event that embarrasses the country. Some wouldn't have been brought to light if it wasn't for interest groups/media like the incident in Pakistan.
If France would ask for support, I would support the cause. Not that they would. They would keep this an internal matter. No nation, unless they were falling apart would ask for outside help for incidents like this. The riots in LA for example. ALthough much shorter in time frame and smaller area of effect, we didn't call out NATO asking for help. It would embarrass us, so no politician in his right mind would call out for help. So they wouldn't ask other nations to assist mainly because it will look they can't maintain order on their own. This isn't like a disaster - London Bombings, World Trade Center terrorist attack, where investigative assistance into the matter would be helpful.
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Black Mage said:Now you're making broad assumptions based on little evidence. I'm not saying any gifts given/recieved are null or void or whatever, but the fact is, it goes back and forth, it's a two-way process. I don't count what my friends owe me, but I try to repay their kindnesses with whatever I can. It's the way friendship works, and both sides need to realise that.
Which country are you assuming I'm from? You make a broad statement there that I'm from some country that demands more of the U.S., which may well be true, but still takes a random shot in the dark. But of course you guys are putting more money and manpower in Iraq. You invaded it. Your government invaded that country, now it has to clean up the mess.
Now you're also associating France with Europe. How does that come about? And why would Europe be precious to me? I don't live there. France isn't precious to me either. I'm not saying they are in any way special or deserving. I was merely responding to the idea that the U.S. gov't offer aid to insult France. As for a long history of things not done right,
You want problems with my country? O.k. The Aparthied system in South Africa was based in part on the way we treated our Aboriginals. Our contributions to charitable orginizations of late have been untimely at best. Our military is in dire need of an overhaul (but still is considered one of the most professional in the world) Our politics of late have been marred with scandal after scandal, which like Bush, nothing seems to stick. Hopefully this Gomery stuff will change that. We are one of the biggest polluters on the planet, we use more water per capita than the U.S. That's but a few things. It's enough info for you to go on to figure it out. But in the future, please refrain from making wild accusations.
This is based on what many people think, believe and know. This is the problem I have with many people that live outside our country. You got plenty of problems in your country but instead of complaining to your leaders about your countries problems you complain about the United States. What do you mean by you didn't that no gifts were given or received? You said it in one of your threads. But remember something else I'm from a country where I can make a random shot and I don't have to take anyone's fire without firing back. Also you are doing the same thing. Finally not to mention we give more aid to countries in trouble than any other. So our time and money goes to ingrates like you instead of citizens like me that lived in this country for over 100 years.
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Sicander said:
You would have to deal with the incessent ****ing. May I suggest a ball gag?
Yea a gag ball and a roll of duct tape.
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We do complain to our leaders. Lots. We're complaining so much it looks like we'll be heading to the polls again soon. Problem is really, everyone complains, but does little to act on it. We could also talk more about issues in Canada, or Brazil, or the Netherlands, but lots of what gets reported on this board has to do with the U.S., or somehow ends up involving the U.S. in some way. It's a fact of geopolitics at the moment.Chrisl0 said:This is based on what many people think, believe and know. This is the problem I have with many people that live outside our country. You got plenty of problems in your country but instead of complaining to your leaders about your countries problems you complain about the United States. What do you mean by you didn't that no gifts were given or received? You said it in one of your threads. But remember something else I'm from a country where I can make a random shot and I don't have to take anyone's fire without firing back. Also you are doing the same thing. Finally not to mention we give more aid to countries in trouble than any other. So our time and money goes to ingrates like you instead of citizens like me that lived in this country for over 100 years.
The only thing I was trying to convey about the gift giving part was that it's generally considered poor practice amongst friends and family to keep a running tally of who owes whom what, so why do it on the international stage? The French helped you geta country all to your own and the statue of liberty. You helped liberate them and restructure after two world wars. But who should count if you were to offer aid, or if they were to ask for aid? Aid isn't about who owes what, it's about saving and improving lives, not nationalistic ****ing. Saving human beings, regardless of nationality, race etc. Aid is also a sore spot amongs both our nations. Regardless of what you might think, the U.S. really doesn't have that great a record of doling out dollars. This simple chart shows the percentage of GNP of aid the last few years. We suck at it. Pretty much all the G7 nations do.
I don't like France, but that does not mean I wish this violence on them, nor do I have a desire for it to be prolonged. A women on crutches was doused in gasoline, and set on fire. She deserved that? GOOD GOD, I hate saying this, but some of the very Anti-Christian sentiment I have been hearing is being circumstantiated in this very thread!
It is wrong for anyone to say that "France Deserves this." The notion that innocent people deserve to suffer is very UN-Christian. If, perhaps, you want to say that "France brought this upon itself", or maybe "France's political and social polices have caused the riots", that is fine. Don't say "they deserve it".
It is the same thing as people saying the United States "Deserved" 9-11. Violence brought upon innocent civilians is always wrong. Even the civilians of France. Come on fellow Christians, lets not be hypocritical.
It is wrong for anyone to say that "France Deserves this." The notion that innocent people deserve to suffer is very UN-Christian. If, perhaps, you want to say that "France brought this upon itself", or maybe "France's political and social polices have caused the riots", that is fine. Don't say "they deserve it".
It is the same thing as people saying the United States "Deserved" 9-11. Violence brought upon innocent civilians is always wrong. Even the civilians of France. Come on fellow Christians, lets not be hypocritical.
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Sadly the woman on crutches and the elderly man who was beaten then died later in the hospital have been overlooked in our anti-French sentiment. It has been easy to say that France deserved the violence visited on them because the damage being done is aimed at cars and buildings. I doubt very much that we would be advocating the senseless rioting if more lives had been threatened or taken in this uprising.
I don't want to see anyone in danger or harmed or God forbid killed but I am not upset with the destructive nature of the rioting. The French government was against us and our position in the Iraqi war; they embraced the Muslims; they accused us of being prejudice and while they were pointing their finger at us the very people that they were supporting jumped up and bit it.
Not assimilating the immigrants and allowing them to form their own pockets of control in parts of the city, where it was rumored that others who were not Muslim were warned to stay out, is a recipe for disaster. The French turned a blind eye to this potential danger and it backfired on them.
It is the arrogance of the French government that I object to and find offensive. Hopefully now they have opened their eyes to what they have created and will be less critical of the United States.
I don't want to see anyone in danger or harmed or God forbid killed but I am not upset with the destructive nature of the rioting. The French government was against us and our position in the Iraqi war; they embraced the Muslims; they accused us of being prejudice and while they were pointing their finger at us the very people that they were supporting jumped up and bit it.
Not assimilating the immigrants and allowing them to form their own pockets of control in parts of the city, where it was rumored that others who were not Muslim were warned to stay out, is a recipe for disaster. The French turned a blind eye to this potential danger and it backfired on them.
It is the arrogance of the French government that I object to and find offensive. Hopefully now they have opened their eyes to what they have created and will be less critical of the United States.
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Black Mage said:We do complain to our leaders. Lots. We're complaining so much it looks like we'll be heading to the polls again soon. Problem is really, everyone complains, but does little to act on it. We could also talk more about issues in Canada, or Brazil, or the Netherlands, but lots of what gets reported on this board has to do with the U.S., or somehow ends up involving the U.S. in some way. It's a fact of geopolitics at the moment.
The only thing I was trying to convey about the gift giving part was that it's generally considered poor practice amongst friends and family to keep a running tally of who owes whom what, so why do it on the international stage? The French helped you geta country all to your own and the statue of liberty. You helped liberate them and restructure after two world wars. But who should count if you were to offer aid, or if they were to ask for aid? Aid isn't about who owes what, it's about saving and improving lives, not nationalistic ****ing. Saving human beings, regardless of nationality, race etc. Aid is also a sore spot amongs both our nations. Regardless of what you might think, the U.S. really doesn't have that great a record of doling out dollars. This simple chart shows the percentage of GNP of aid the last few years. We suck at it. Pretty much all the G7 nations do.
Maybe, but at best we are even with France. They don't owe us nor do we. Also I'm not only talking about money i'm talking about aid. We have give plenty of that out.
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GoingNova said:I don't like France, but that does not mean I wish this violence on them, nor do I have a desire for it to be prolonged. A women on crutches was doused in gasoline, and set on fire. She deserved that? GOOD GOD, I hate saying this, but some of the very Anti-Christian sentiment I have been hearing is being circumstantiated in this very thread!
It is wrong for anyone to say that "France Deserves this." The notion that innocent people deserve to suffer is very UN-Christian. If, perhaps, you want to say that "France brought this upon itself", or maybe "France's political and social polices have caused the riots", that is fine. Don't say "they deserve it".
It is the same thing as people saying the United States "Deserved" 9-11. Violence brought upon innocent civilians is always wrong. Even the civilians of France. Come on fellow Christians, lets not be hypocritical.
No they don't deserve death. But they deserved to be betrayed by people they protected. Those people being Muslims. Also it's been shown that many terrorist come from France that have Muslims background. But they still protected them after all the terrorist activities that go on around the world. The French are arrogant and hateful people that always criticized our policies this is the main reason I hate them. They should *#^& off and take their noses out of our business and put it back in their's. If we always listened to France we probably be occupied by a enemy country.
Im not saying any one particular person in France deserves this, I am mearly saying that France as a whole, had it comin'. It was them that brought this on themselves. The Christian response would be to turn the other cheek and help out yes. HOWEVER! As has been stated SOOOOOO many times, our governemnt should be separate from the church. Sorry to throw that back in someone's face (Not you Nova) Actually no Im not sorry. I know its not very Christianly of me but that does not make it any less enjoyable. I have no problems whatsoever with, say, people sending money to aid France or something like that. I DO have issue with our Government doing it. Doing so may heal relations with France, but would it be at the cost of this very same thing happening to us? France should have listened to us in the first place. We cant save everyone. We dont have the recources. We are in the middle of a war here. A war we need to focus on if we are going to win. It is a war on two fronts, a war against Terrorism and a war against illegal immigration. We have to put out focus on these fronts. If we are to help France I want our governent to be sure that it will not be at the sacrifice of our own battles.GoingNova said:I don't like France, but that does not mean I wish this violence on them, nor do I have a desire for it to be prolonged. A women on crutches was doused in gasoline, and set on fire. She deserved that? GOOD GOD, I hate saying this, but some of the very Anti-Christian sentiment I have been hearing is being circumstantiated in this very thread!
It is wrong for anyone to say that "France Deserves this." The notion that innocent people deserve to suffer is very UN-Christian. If, perhaps, you want to say that "France brought this upon itself", or maybe "France's political and social polices have caused the riots", that is fine. Don't say "they deserve it".
It is the same thing as people saying the United States "Deserved" 9-11. Violence brought upon innocent civilians is always wrong. Even the civilians of France. Come on fellow Christians, lets not be hypocritical.
My justification for France "Deserving this" comes from my sister. Who is, ironically a HUGE libral. (Not that she is fat, but that she is very libral in her opinions, oh Lord I hope she isnt reading this) Anyway, she has a favorite line she uses alot when she sees somone doing what France did.
"Stop poking the bear"
France poked the bear, and the bear mauled them. They should have known it was a bear and that bears dont like to be poked. When you poke bears, they maul your arm off. Its the sad truth of bears. They kept poking the bear and saying "Don't you want to be French?" and finally the bear stood up, rubbed the sleep out of his eyes, scrached his big bear butt, ate his big bear breakfast, said "No, I'm a bear, I want to be a bear, I don't want to be French, and please stop poking me." and then mauled their arm off.
Now we in America also have a bear. At the moment we are sitting back and singing lulibies to the bear and saying, "Hey its ok if you want to be a bear, but you gotta be a bear that lives by the rules of the American bear cave" And for the moment the bear is still hibernating. Now we could come over to France with our bear hunting rifles and save them from thier bear and patch up thier maul wounds. But what happens when we come back to our bear cave and find our bear is awake and hungry? And we used up all our bear hunting ammo in France?
My solution would be to drug our bear, drag him out of our bear cave and throw him back to the bear cave he came from, THEN go over to France's bear cave and help them get rid of thier bear.
I should write a children's book.
"Stop poking the bear"
France poked the bear, and the bear mauled them. They should have known it was a bear and that bears dont like to be poked. When you poke bears, they maul your arm off. Its the sad truth of bears. They kept poking the bear and saying "Don't you want to be French?" and finally the bear stood up, rubbed the sleep out of his eyes, scrached his big bear butt, ate his big bear breakfast, said "No, I'm a bear, I want to be a bear, I don't want to be French, and please stop poking me." and then mauled their arm off.
Now we in America also have a bear. At the moment we are sitting back and singing lulibies to the bear and saying, "Hey its ok if you want to be a bear, but you gotta be a bear that lives by the rules of the American bear cave" And for the moment the bear is still hibernating. Now we could come over to France with our bear hunting rifles and save them from thier bear and patch up thier maul wounds. But what happens when we come back to our bear cave and find our bear is awake and hungry? And we used up all our bear hunting ammo in France?
My solution would be to drug our bear, drag him out of our bear cave and throw him back to the bear cave he came from, THEN go over to France's bear cave and help them get rid of thier bear.
I should write a children's book.
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We should let France clean their own wounds for once. We been holding their hand for too long and they don't even like us. The individuals don't deserve to die but France deserves whats happening.
